Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

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estrica2000
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Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by estrica2000 » Fri Mar 28, 2014 1:28 pm

i wonder this because i see the list of bugs which are fixed on the new annonounced release 7.5.2 which are so
basic that makes me think how you call this as a stable version. I want to make music and not being a beta tester, figuring out what is working and not. Please respect my money and choice. Buy testers.

Dee
Last edited by estrica2000 on Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Sentenced » Fri Mar 28, 2014 1:53 pm

Because you still buy this (i.e. because they can).

Do you think that they have any morals whatsoever?

Supply and demand.

End.

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by estrica2000 » Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:14 pm

The best for the costumers is the best for their business also. This is a bad experience for a new costumer like me. do i have to get used to this? hmmm i don't like this idea and IMO is not fair. Buying a "Professional software" and being a beta tester during 6 months? wow. Please be honest.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by TKW » Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:35 pm

I have to agree Estrica.

People buy these updates because they are lured in by the new features and believe the program has been tested to a 'reasonable' degree.

With the problems I've been having with C7.5 I really will have to think carefully before upgrading in future and wait until at least the major problems have been ironed out.

That's not a silly threat to Steinberg, it just makes good business sense, and economic sense to do so and could alleviate hours of frustration for me trying to bug-fix.

You wouldn't buy an untested washing machine and expect to have to keep replacing bits yourself when it doesnt work properly. I know software may always have a bug or two but as I said, the consumer should have a resonable expectation that software has been thoroughly tested.

/end of rant!

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Sentenced » Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:21 pm

TKW wrote:
That's not a silly threat to Steinberg, it just makes good business sense, and economic sense to do so and could alleviate hours of frustration for me trying to bug-fix.

You wouldn't buy an untested washing machine and expect to have to keep replacing bits yourself when it doesnt work properly.
As long as their product is

a) legal or even barely legal (i.e. it is legal indeed or they don't lose cases in the courts from angry customer lawsuits)

and

b) people continue to pay them in any case (regardless of how faulty the software may be),

the "economic sense" for them is to milk the cow.

Welcome to free market!

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Mr. Beer » Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:58 pm

Probably because "beta" means it is a pre-release version and major changes can be made before the final release. That being said, there is no 7.2, it's 7.5.20. Also, show me a complex piece of software that doesn't have "bugs". I think I can safely say that there are many users that do not have any "show stopping" issues as a result of these "bugs".
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by TKW » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:09 pm

Sentenced wrote:As long as their product is

a) legal or even barely legal (i.e. it is legal indeed or they don't lose cases in the courts from angry customer lawsuits)

and

b) people continue to pay them in any case (regardless of how faulty the software may be),

the "economic sense" for them is to milk the cow.

Welcome to free market!
True, which is why I'm becoming vocal about the issues I'm facing so that Steinberg can be aware of any problems which should have been discovered before release, and they can be aware if/when their customers are becoming disgruntled...

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by greggybud » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:26 pm

Mr. Beer wrote: I think I can safely say that there are many users that do not have any "show stopping" issues as a result of these "bugs".
Care to define "show stopping?"

Specifically, how do I implement Cubase 7.5 using key commands with 4 monitors, 2 which are dedicated to full screen mixers, 1 for the project page, 3 monitors in linked mode, and 1 for Mixer 3 dedicated to groups, effects, inputs and master outs? If you know how to change focus when in full mixer mode, please let me know.

While the above isn't a "bug" it certainly has slowed my workflow well below the level of Cubase 6.5. Before anyone tells me to go back to 6.5, I could but I paid to upgrade to 7. I'm passionate about these things working because if they made these basic workflow functions work, it would be a good step forward over 6.5. And of course for myself, none of the DAW competitors come close to what I can achieve in Cubase.

Do you ever use Instrument tracks? When I mute an instrument track in the mix console the same track in the project page doesn't indicate any mute. When I mute an instrument track in the project page the corresponding track in the mix console doesn't indicate any mute. In my studio, mutes and solos are kind of of important...maybe even show-stopping.

I do not know of any users who do not have this mute "bug." I believe Steinberg has verified this as a real bug or issue as they call them.

Any further elaboration or explanation of other "bugs" and I risk being banned by a moderator. However discussion and verification of all kinds of Cubase 7.5 issues can be openly discussed at the Gearslutz Cubase forum.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Buchanan » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:43 pm

greggybud wrote:
Mr. Beer wrote: I think I can safely say that there are many users that do not have any "show stopping" issues as a result of these "bugs".
Care to define "show stopping?"

Specifically, how do I implement Cubase 7.5 using key commands with 4 monitors, 2 which are dedicated to full screen mixers, 1 for the project page, 3 monitors in linked mode, and 1 for Mixer 3 dedicated to groups, effects, inputs and master outs? If you know how to change focus when in full mixer mode, please let me know.

While the above isn't a "bug" it certainly has slowed my workflow well below the level of Cubase 6.5. Before anyone tells me to go back to 6.5, I could but I paid to upgrade to 7. I'm passionate about these things working because if they made these basic workflow functions work, it would be a good step forward over 6.5. And of course for myself, none of the DAW competitors come close to what I can achieve in Cubase.

Do you ever use Instrument tracks? When I mute an instrument track in the mix console the same track in the project page doesn't indicate any mute. When I mute an instrument track in the project page the corresponding track in the mix console doesn't indicate any mute. In my studio, mutes and solos are kind of of important.

I do not know of any users who do not have this mute "bug." I believe Steinberg has verified this as a real bug or issue as they call them.

Any further elaboration or explanation of other "bugs" and I risk being banned by a moderator. However discussion and verification of all kinds of Cubase 7.5 issues can be openly discussed at the Gearslutz Cubase forum.
You did of course, check it all worked together before you opened the doors...? Like a real gig. 4 monitors? We're not dealing with a toy rig then? If anyone / everyone actually knows two bits about serious software for over five minutes they'd know that glitches and bugs have to be researched, dealt with, reported and hope they're fixable. Otherwise it's just more forum blethering.
The mute bug might well have been verified but WE (and I count myself as fairly understanding of computer gubbins) just don't have a clue what the problem is at the programming end. The bug might be in the compilation software for instance... so, you mentioned it, it's gone in. Keep reminding them every so often, it'll probably get done.
Four monitors? Whew! I haven't got that many eyes. :mrgreen:
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by sycophant » Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:54 pm

TKW wrote:You wouldn't buy an untested washing machine and expect to have to keep replacing bits yourself when it doesnt work properly. I know software may always have a bug or two but as I said, the consumer should have a resonable expectation that software has been thoroughly tested.

/end of rant!
Please dispense with "car" and "domestic appliance" analogies, they are inappropriate and can result in ban.

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by sycophant » Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:56 pm

greggybud wrote:
Mr. Beer wrote: I think I can safely say that there are many users that do not have any "show stopping" issues as a result of these "bugs".
Do you ever use Instrument tracks? When I mute an instrument track in the mix console the same track in the project page doesn't indicate any mute. When I mute an instrument track in the project page the corresponding track in the mix console doesn't indicate any mute. In my studio, mutes and solos are kind of of important...maybe even show-stopping.

I do not know of any users who do not have this mute "bug." I believe Steinberg has verified this as a real bug or issue as they call them.
Link?

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by estrica2000 » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:38 pm

sycophant wrote:
TKW wrote:You wouldn't buy an untested washing machine and expect to have to keep replacing bits yourself when it doesnt work properly. I know software may always have a bug or two but as I said, the consumer should have a resonable expectation that software has been thoroughly tested.

/end of rant!
Please dispense with "car" and "domestic appliance" analogies, they are inappropriate and can result in ban.
This is real world, musians use a daw to make music. I would say that mute and solo button are probably one of the most basic peaces of any DAW. This are fixes announced related with the the solo and mute:

.The solo defeat function of instrument tracks now works as expected.
.The preference "Select channels/track on solo" now works as expected when enabling the solo input of VST instruments.
.The solo button now works on external instruments as expected.
. Unmuting a folder track now unmutes all tracks inside the folder as expected.
.The agent "Hide muted tracks" works now on muted instrument tracks.
.Muting instrument tracks and MIDI sub-tracks now works as expected.
.The "Mute" key command now works for instrument tracks in the Project window as expected.
.The function "Deactivate all mute states" now works as expected after selecting "Mute input" on virtual instruments.


I have felt almost all this issues, i would say it's bit annoying and breaks a lot the creative/natural flow process.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Mr. Beer » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:58 pm

That why I said "I think I can", to affirm my assumption as not an absolute
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by sycophant » Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:07 pm

Mr. Beer wrote:That why I said "I think I can", to affirm my assumption as not an absolute
I can say too that with Cubase anything is possible with the multiplicity of ways once can accomplish things, which always provides adequate workarounds.

There are very few situations that have occured during the entire development of Cubase that could be classified as genuine showstoppers.

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Rotund » Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:02 pm

Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?
It is much harder to charge money for a beta version.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by theRoyal1 » Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:45 pm

Rotund wrote:
Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?
It is much harder to charge money for a beta version.
...and there it is ..

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by curteye » Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:36 am

Aloha guys,
Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?
'A rose by any other name................'

IMHO
Don't spend your $$$$.
Spend your time.
Wait for the demo version.
Then if you like it, grab it. If not, do not.

{'-'}
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by Buchanan » Sat Mar 29, 2014 1:22 am

And why be worried about "beta" versions at all? If you think it's a beta version don't buy it. If you've bought it and you think it's a beta use an earlier version and wait til it's fixed and think of it like a pre-purchase. It's kiddy pocket money cheap anyway. A pro studio uses the petty cash. :lol:
Who cares?
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by jimmys69 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:24 am

He he. Funny, I must have a unique ability to work around any bugs in new versions of Cubase. Why? Because the new features included with each version allow me to do something that improves my workflow. Complaining about what went wrong is just something to deal with while waiting for the little stuff to get fixed.

I can wait or just use a previous version. Try that with one of your kids....

Oh, and I have never had most of the issues I hear so many complain about. Never had a crash since 6.5.

Seems most issues are caused by poorly setup or built computers. Mine isn't even that great.

I feel sad for those who have issues or feel used, but come on.. you enlisted right?
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by jluca » Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:04 pm

I was ready to buy cubase 7 but i've tested, thanks to my friend, against Logic Pro X, under mac of course, this because I was attracted by new features, new mixer and etc. Logic X have some bugs but never crashed, Cubase 7 had a lot of crashes and problems with plugs, bugs, etc. Results is? Actually there are not professional audio application bugs free.
I cannot risk to loose time, work and songs because Steinberg or Apple need free beta tester. Another little thing to consider is the price, 180euro for Logic 3 times more for cubase.
Sorry to say that but Cubase 6.5 in 64bit mode is the best DAW in the market now, even is not bugs free too. I will wait cubase 8 and cubase 7 bug fixes before buy the app.

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by bjones306 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:06 pm

greggybud wrote:
Care to define "show stopping?"

Specifically, how do I implement Cubase 7.5 using key commands with 4 monitors, 2 which are dedicated to full screen mixers, 1 for the project page, 3 monitors in linked mode, and 1 for Mixer 3 dedicated to groups, effects, inputs and master outs? If you know how to change focus when in full mixer mode, please let me know.
Personally I am having no issue what so ever with 3 monitors here..... Just span the entire cubase window across all 3, or in your case all 4. Put the individual windows where you want them... ie... mixer 1-3, trackview, effects..... Even better save it as a workspace (within the project or globally)... and alternate between different views with your alt-num keys..... pretty simple actually. Unless I am misunderstanding what your trying to get at.... I don't really see an issue here.

As for some of the other posts.... boy... the trolls are out on this. But as usual, it's the nitpicking and in most cases pretty petty complaints of many uninformed or uneducated users who either haven't taken the time to get to know the software, or troubleshooted (is that a word? :D) the problems with personal hardware that might also be causing issues. None of the issues I have personally run into on C7.5 would warrant calling it a BETA by any wild stretch of the imagination.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by estrica2000 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:30 pm

well many users say there are always workarounds with cubase, .. and that is true. You can do whatever you want with 90's trackers with workarounds either. When you buy a washing machine which is not working properly you workaround washing yourself manually. So it is a great washing machine anyway because this workaround is a possible.

.The solo defeat function of instrument tracks now works as expected.
.The solo button now works on external instruments as expected.
. Unmuting a folder track now unmutes all tracks inside the folder as expected.
.Muting instrument tracks and MIDI sub-tracks now works as expected.
.The "Mute" key command now works for instrument tracks in the Project window as expected.

i am just picking this ones, which i use everyday (or better: would like too). What are the workarounds beside not using them?
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by bjones306 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:39 pm

Well.... the simple workaround of solo defeat not working would be to solo the given track that it's currently not working on..... The workaround for external instruments would be to mute everything else in the project..... The workaround for a folder track would be opening said folder and unmuting the channels manually..... Getting the picture? Again, that wouldn't warrant calling the product a BETA. And obviously they are aware of what most of us would call small issues and are trying to fix them. And yes.... every DAW goes through such bug fix phases after release.
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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by sycophant » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:45 pm

bjones306 wrote:As for some of the other posts.... boy... the trolls are out on this. But as usual, it's the nitpicking and in most cases pretty petty complaints of many uninformed or uneducated users who either haven't taken the time to get to know the software, or troubleshooted (is that a word? :D) the problems with personal hardware that might also be causing issues. None of the issues I have personally run into on C7.5 would warrant calling it a BETA by any wild stretch of the imagination.
The forum can be divided into 2 categories (maybe 3 if you include staff), the first are those that can work with what they have and the second are those who have trouble because they want the program to work according to their ideals.

The problem with preconceived notions is they detract from the task at hand, that is the expectations or desires we have of ourselves to achieve something, or the requirements of those around us.

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Re: Why 7.5 and 7.5.1 is not called beta?

Post by bjones306 » Sat Mar 29, 2014 4:18 pm

sycophant wrote:
The forum can be divided into 2 categories (maybe 3 if you include staff), the first are those that can work with what they have and the second are those who have trouble because they want the program to work according to their ideals.

The problem with preconceived notions is they detract from the task at hand, that is the expectations or desires we have of ourselves to achieve something, or the requirements of those around us.
Actually I would say this is wrong on a few points. If your wanting the program to work according to your ideals, then you should have done the research into said software to make sure it conforms with those ideals. And then of course, you have to go into any new piece of software under the assumption that it will have some bugs. The OP went out of his/her way to question weather or not the software should be called beta.... This statement alone is sort of a troll based comment in and of it's self. As with more than a few topics brought up on this forum, a post with such a title doesn't really have a "task at hand" other than to diminish the quality of help or support that a forum should provide. In some cases the motive of some of the previous posts in this thread are clearly an attempt to debase or demean the product rather than actually support any constructive conversation. It might serve a forum well just to have a specific area for meaningless *witch* so that they are kept out of what should be a more meaningful and constructive conversation. :D
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