No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

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marysplace
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No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by marysplace » Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:07 am

i see that the DeNoiser bundled with Nuendo 5 doesn't even work with this edition. Does anyone know of a DeNoiser for Nuendo for Mac? Sonnox plugins load up, but do absolutely no processing (a problem other users have experienced as well. All dressed up, but no place to go).

I've got a guitar track with a bad ground. Thanks.

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Mark Williams » Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:56 am

I use the iZotope RX-2 package, and while I think you can use it as a plug, it's enough of a processor hog that I usually use it free standing and import the improved audio file afterwards.

For what it's worth, I still have a couple of the old Roland SN-700 denoiser gizmos, and they are quite useful for ground buzz in guitar and keyboard tracks. When needed, I set them up as external effects and insert them into channels like plugs. You can probably find these used for a low price.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:40 am

Have you tried using RX as an offline process plugin? For the various noisy, poppy, crackly crap I have to deal with here on a daily basis, offline processing is the way to go-- really fast, and with keyboard commands assigned, pretty automatic.

The only time I really use the standalone is for batch noise reduction of stuff I know is consistent over many hours... and that's almost never the case for me.

Ultimately, RX is so good that the bar to exceed it is so high that it's hard to imagine an included plugin that could compete. It's become such a consistent part of my daily workflow that I didn't even notice that the formerly included plugins weren't there anymore!

As a plugin, the RX2 denoiser is not that much of a hog. Try it, plugin-wise. I've used it as an insert before with no processing issues (even on my old G5), but because the nature of the background noise in my stuff tends to change over time, offline plugin processing really works better for me.

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by MattiasNYC » Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:03 am

Chewy Papadopoulos wrote:Have you tried using RX as an offline process plugin? For the various noisy, poppy, crackly crap I have to deal with here on a daily basis, offline processing is the way to go-- really fast, and with keyboard commands assigned, pretty automatic.

Chewy
Could you tell me how you set it up with key commands? I'm curious how you make it more effective. I'm normally on PT and Nuendo's seriously crappy handling of offline-process windows/plugs annoys me to no end when doing restoration.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:44 pm

Lydiot wrote:Could you tell me how you set it up with key commands? I'm curious how you make it more effective. I'm normally on PT and Nuendo's seriously crappy handling of offline-process windows/plugs annoys me to no end when doing restoration.
Nothing special-- I just have each part of the RX suite assigned to an easy-to-access key combo. For a large, dialog-heavy project I'll take and save noise profiles of each problem location (plus repeatable intermittent tonal problems, such as indoor pipe noises, fans, ac hum, passing cars, etc) and will, if necessary, make a batch process for basic early treatment (denoiser/decrackler, for example), and work with the spectral editor as I go.

I haven't really been bothered by the issues you've described in your thread a while back (maybe because I "pre-treat" my tracks with noise reduction, as a rule, which is usually a simple option the way I typically receive files; there are certainly many cases where this would not be practical). My only comment there is that I sometimes wish there were a more elegant way to open, sample and repair within the spectral editor. Or that I could assign key commands or a macro to do the same.

Is this at all what you're asking?

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by MattiasNYC » Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:46 pm

Chewy Papadopoulos wrote:
Lydiot wrote:Could you tell me how you set it up with key commands? I'm curious how you make it more effective. I'm normally on PT and Nuendo's seriously crappy handling of offline-process windows/plugs annoys me to no end when doing restoration.
Nothing special-- I just have each part of the RX suite assigned to an easy-to-access key combo. For a large, dialog-heavy project I'll take and save noise profiles of each problem location (plus repeatable intermittent tonal problems, such as indoor pipe noises, fans, ac hum, passing cars, etc) and will, if necessary, make a batch process for basic early treatment (denoiser/decrackler, for example), and work with the spectral editor as I go.

I haven't really been bothered by the issues you've described in your thread a while back (maybe because I "pre-treat" my tracks with noise reduction, as a rule, which is usually a simple option the way I typically receive files; there are certainly many cases where this would not be practical). My only comment there is that I sometimes wish there were a more elegant way to open, sample and repair within the spectral editor. Or that I could assign key commands or a macro to do the same.

Is this at all what you're asking?

Chewy
I think so. So you basically just have a key combo to open up the plug-in?
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:14 pm

Lydiot wrote: I think so. So you basically just have a key combo to open up the plug-in?
Nine times out of ten, yes. I also have a macro or two that will, say, switch tools after opening the plugin-- switching from range to arrow tool, for example, for access to the scissors tool (see tool modifier thread!) if the project is not best served by range editing.

But for the most part, it's just as you said.

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:00 pm

I use RX as a standalone software.

Usually I have a directory window of my project's audio path and an RX instance open on a seperate space (OS X).
The directory is sotred by date, so when I "bounce to a new file" it will be top of the list.
I drag and drop into RX, save as "filename_denoised" and drop back into Nuendo.

Steinberg needs to improve this! I wish they would concentrate their energies on those "little" big annoyances in workflow!

Ollie

P.S.: I find the Sonnox DeBuzzer from Wavelab quite useful as well.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:09 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:I use RX as a standalone software.

Usually I have a directory window of my project's audio path and an RX instance open on a seperate space (OS X).
The directory is sotred by date, so when I "bounce to a new file" it will be top of the list.
I drag and drop into RX, save as "filename_denoised" and drop back into Nuendo.

Steinberg needs to improve this! I wish they would concentrate their energies on those "little" big annoyances in workflow!
Not trying to be contentious... just curious:

1) Why don't you like to use denoiser as a plugin offline process? Seems to me it would save you time and keystrokes-- unless your objective is to process long files while you continue to work. That I can easily understand; I even sometimes run RX standalone on a separate networked computer so I can batch out a bunch of long files while I keep working...

2) What improvements would you want to see? What annoys you about the way it works now? (maybe your annoyance will be contagious; i.e. I'll learn something!

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:21 pm

Well, RX does a lot more than just plain denoising, doesn't it. Most of the times I want to be able to use the editor to it's full potential and a plugin just does not work as well as standalone software for that.

I think it would be cool to be able too double click on a region in Nuendo and have it open in RX or Wavelab, edit, close and continue to work. That's really what I would want to see as an improvement. Until then, it would be nice it Nuendo could create a new file when dragging onto the desktop or into a different application.

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:18 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:I think it would be cool to be able too double click on a region in Nuendo and have it open in RX or Wavelab, edit, close and continue to work.
Yes! Remembering the days of Cubase VST. One of the little things that meant so much and got lost in the shuffle.

In regards to RX-- I guess I tend to use the different aspects of the suite in very specifically different ways-- when locations have been pre-treated for crackle and noise, about 85% of my work is with the spectral editor. And I'm all for what you're talking about-- would love it if you could select a range, call up the spectral editor and have everything captured and ready to edit.

Chewy
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by bilekt3 » Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:33 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote: I think it would be cool to be able too double click on a region in Nuendo and have it open in RX or Wavelab, edit, close and continue to work. That's really what I would want to see as an improvement. Until then, it would be nice it Nuendo could create a new file when dragging onto the desktop or into a different application.
Very nice idea. I am missing it too.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by neilwilkes » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:11 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:Well, RX does a lot more than just plain denoising, doesn't it. Most of the times I want to be able to use the editor to it's full potential and a plugin just does not work as well as standalone software for that.

I think it would be cool to be able too double click on a region in Nuendo and have it open in RX or Wavelab, edit, close and continue to work. That's really what I would want to see as an improvement. Until then, it would be nice it Nuendo could create a new file when dragging onto the desktop or into a different application.

Ollie
I'm with you 100% on this one, Ollie - that is (okay, was) a seriously useful setting.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by bilekt3 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:23 pm

From other point of view: I think that main problem is that DeNoiser and DeClicker VST plugins bundled with Nuendo 5 or 5.5 are 32 bit. Is that true?

@Steinberg - Will be This basic but very useful plugins in Nuendo 6?

Thanks

Tomas
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Chewy Papadopoulos » Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:34 pm

bilekt3 wrote:From other point of view: I think that main problem is that DeNoiser and DeClicker VST plugins bundled with Nuendo 5 or 5.5 are 32 bit. Is that true?
You're on a MacBook Pro... it's probably not a 32 vs 64 issue so much as that those plugins are written with PowerPC code and the last two OS versions do not run them. Rosetta, the component that translated them into "Intel", is no longer part of OSX.

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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by bilekt3 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:47 pm

Chewy Papadopoulos wrote:
bilekt3 wrote:From other point of view: I think that main problem is that DeNoiser and DeClicker VST plugins bundled with Nuendo 5 or 5.5 are 32 bit. Is that true?
You're on a MacBook Pro... it's probably not a 32 vs 64 issue so much as that those plugins are written with PowerPC code and the last two OS versions do not run them. Rosetta, the component that translated them into "Intel", is no longer part of OSX.

Chewy
Ollie take some light on this problem. Who is interested take a look on this thread - http://www.steinberg.net/forum/viewtopi ... 77&t=35096.

Regards

Tomas
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Neil K » Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:21 pm

The RX2 Denoiser is superior and is an everyday tool for me. I occasionally use it as a plugin. When I do, I usually "freeze" the track after adjusting it to save CPU. My normal workflow though, is to rename clips (by putting a character in front such as "@-") so I can find them in the RX2 software. I close out Nuendo, open RX2, process the clip, and overwrite the audio file. Upon opening Nuendo, it redraws the waveform and is now de-noised.

It's a risky way to work, but I can restore the clip if it came from an AAF/OMF. If I'm squeamish, I'll duplicate the track and bounce the clips before denoising.

One great trick inside the RX2 software an engineer in my studio discovered was to perform equalization within RX2 to rescue location audio (or other troublesome clips). Typically, lav mics create a boxy or honky sound when placed on the chest. In RX2, you can see the offending frequencies as bright orange. Using the EQ operation, either reduce that frequency over the entire clip, or lasso the areas and apply individually. It has really changed the way we work.
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by neilwilkes » Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:12 pm

Neil K wrote:The RX2 Denoiser is superior and is an everyday tool for me. I occasionally use it as a plugin. When I do, I usually "freeze" the track after adjusting it to save CPU. My normal workflow though, is to rename clips (by putting a character in front such as "@-") so I can find them in the RX2 software. I close out Nuendo, open RX2, process the clip, and overwrite the audio file. Upon opening Nuendo, it redraws the waveform and is now de-noised.

It's a risky way to work, but I can restore the clip if it came from an AAF/OMF. If I'm squeamish, I'll duplicate the track and bounce the clips before denoising.

One great trick inside the RX2 software an engineer in my studio discovered was to perform equalization within RX2 to rescue location audio (or other troublesome clips). Typically, lav mics create a boxy or honky sound when placed on the chest. In RX2, you can see the offending frequencies as bright orange. Using the EQ operation, either reduce that frequency over the entire clip, or lasso the areas and apply individually. It has really changed the way we work.
I honestly do not think anybody is disputing RX2 is superb - I will even have to go buy it (again) myself because it can do things my Oxford bundle cannot do - not to mention the Oxford Restoration tools are still only 32-bit even though the stripped down Sonnox versions in WaveLab are 64-bit (go figure).
The point is that a post tool at the price point of Nuendo really ought to include decent restoration tools - have a look at what is there out of the box in Adobe's Audition!!
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by bilekt3 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:43 am

neilwilkes wrote: I honestly do not think anybody is disputing RX2 is superb - I will even have to go buy it (again) myself because it can do things my Oxford bundle cannot do - not to mention the Oxford Restoration tools are still only 32-bit even though the stripped down Sonnox versions in WaveLab are 64-bit (go figure).
The point is that a post tool at the price point of Nuendo really ought to include decent restoration tools - have a look at what is there out of the box in Adobe's Audition!!
+1
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Re: No DeNoiser for Nuendo 5.5?

Post by Big K » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:52 am

absolutely +1
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Ist is an Armutszeugnis??

Post by Big K » Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:38 pm

Hi Chaps...

The missing of restoration tools is already showing ...

Have a listen to this
http://www.steinberg.net/en/products/nu ... start.html

LOL ... I am (not) amused by the noise floor of the speakers takes. .. There is not even a fade in/out.
Not that this would bother a carpenter when looking for a new buzz saw..., but .....

Shouldn't it be second nature for us to look out for quality problems like that and correct them, before handing
out our work to customers? If Nuendo still had the denoiser plug this could have been corrected by a flick of a finger.
I mean, how or who can make speach recordings with noise, these days..?? Is there a plug-in for that?
;-)

Big K ( the EAR )
Nuendo 10, WaveLab 9.5, RME, UAD, PoCo, Win10/64 bit, PC i7 3930K, 16GB RAM, Intensity Pro, Melodyne, Spectrasonics, VSL, All Brainworx & PA, Genelec 1031 for 5.1, Quested HQ 210, NS10s, sevaW lla, LAWO, Neumanns, Brauners, Sennheisers, Schoeps, Sony DASH3324S, 42 RUs of classic hardware, professionally build and designed studio acoustics. SB-User since Cubase 2.0, Nuendo 1.5 ...

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