Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

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dennisjr
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Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by dennisjr » Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:51 am

With this update do I still have to route from a VST Instrument track, into a group track, then to a audio track?
It would be very sad if so. Because now NI's Maschine is coming with 16 outs.

Please tell me I can route directly to an audio track!!!

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:05 am

Yes you cannot route directly to an audio track, in the same way you cannot route audio to a VST.

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by More Cowbell » Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:44 am

You create a group channel. Then send the output from vst instrument to that group. Fi you use VST rack (F11) then choose the vst stereo output to that group. The groupchannel output should be "no output. Then create a stereo channel. Choose the groupchannel as input. The click the monitor buttom och the stereo channel. Press record!

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:02 am

More Cowbell wrote:...The groupchannel output should be "no output. Then create a stereo channel. Choose the groupchannel as input. The click the monitor buttom och the stereo channel. Press record!
Surely there is an easier way?

How does it work in other programs?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:03 am

dennisjr wrote:With this update do I still have to route from a VST Instrument track, into a group track, then to a audio track?
It would be very sad if so. Because now NI's Maschine is coming with 16 outs.
You didn´t even have to do that in C5...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:05 am

thinkingcap wrote:You didn´t even have to do that in C5...
Didn't have to do what?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:06 am

bentley wrote:
thinkingcap wrote:You didn´t even have to do that in C5...
Didn't have to do what?
Route to groups then to audio...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:09 am

Ok thinkingcap, so what do you do short of freezing an instrument track or using batch export?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:14 am

bentley wrote:Ok thinkingcap, so what do you do short of freezing an instrument track or using batch export?
I´m still talking about internal summing...
You can choose any output bus of your project as audio track input, as long as you´re not creating a feedback loop. There is no need to go via group tracks first...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:17 am

thinkingcap wrote:You can choose any output bus of your project as audio track input, as long as you´re not creating a feedback loop. There is no need to go via group tracks first...
Yes but isn't this the reason why year in year out there are complaints, in that the notion of "movable frozen parts" and so on can even make it to a FAQ?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by dennisjr » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:18 am

Being one of the top DAW's, and my favourite too, I think it is a shame Steinberg didn't add this long time ago!

Same as adding support for .flac in Wavelab. But that belongs to another thread.
Sorry for dropping it here.

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:25 am

bentley wrote:
thinkingcap wrote:You can choose any output bus of your project as audio track input, as long as you´re not creating a feedback loop. There is no need to go via group tracks first...
Yes but isn't this the reason why year in year out there are complaints, in that the notion of "movable frozen parts" and so on can even make it to a FAQ?
Sorry, don´t understand what you mean with that? The question was about having to route to groups first to record internally. At least that´s how I understood it...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:28 am

Hi

I am saying that due to the various aspects of VST and ASIO you cannot (at this time) have a streamlined way of working with MIDI then onto VST and finally ASIO output.

The same is also true for inputting audio to VST.

While cubase is awesome, it does leave a great deal to be desired in my view in terms of audio handling.

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:42 am

bentley wrote:Hi

I am saying that due to the various aspects of VST and ASIO you cannot (at this time) have a streamlined way of working with MIDI then onto VST and finally ASIO output.

The same is also true for inputting audio to VST.

While cubase is awesome, it does leave a great deal to be desired in my view in terms of audio handling.
Sorry, I´m maybe ebeing a little thick here, but I still don´t get what you´re aiming at, sorry :oops:
But reading this thread about assigning subgroups and deconnecting them-*flower*, it seems to me, many users don´t even know how stream lined (or let´s better say: less convoluted) things can be, if you take some time to actually look into the program. And by that I´m not saying, everything is great...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:45 am

thinkingcap wrote:Sorry, I´m maybe being a little thick here, but I still don´t get what you´re aiming at, sorry :oops:

But reading this thread about assigning subgroups and deconnecting *flower*, it seems to me, many users don´t even know how stream lined (or let´s better say: less convoluted) things can be, if you take some time to actually look into the program. And by that I´m not saying, everything is great...
I'm saying things at present *can't* be as simple as what users would like simply due to the nature (or design) of the VST/ASIO systems, which are basically separate technologies so while cubase has the most features of all DAW's, it's methods are not always necessarily the most streamlined.

Cheers

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by manakesna » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:09 pm

I also agree that Cubase is far from perfect and probably won't be in its C6 incarnation either - cos then a real upgrade would require them having a melodyne DNA editor embedded in every audio track - but, if i understood well, wasn't this post originally referring to internal summing which is a function available since C4, like this http://www.steinbergusers.com/vids/XML_ ... ntent.html (internal summing)
(i recently attached this link to another post, pls don't think i make a buck for every link attached :)
hy·po·ton·ic (h p -t n k). adj. 1. Having less than normal tone or tension, as of muscles or arteries or sounds or thresholds

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:19 pm

bentley wrote:I'm saying things at present *can't* be as simple as what users would like simply due to the nature (or design) of the VST/ASIO systems, which are basically separate technologies so while cubase has the most features of all DAW's, it's methods are not always necessarily the most streamlined.

Cheers
Well, surely it never will be, and simple (or "good") for one person is not simple ("good") for someone else. And as always there are people, who can understand his more easily than others...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 12:23 pm

Why never possible?

Does it not say something that those of us here, completely ignorant to programming are able to understand what is the fundamental flaw in the SDK(s).

Steinberg set the standards, now is the time to start improving them for the future of audio and media on the computer otherwise how will this application eventually be ported to the next generation of workstation, ie tablet using firmware based OS?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by dennisjr » Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:14 pm

Ok I admit I know nothing about DAW's when it comes to programming, but please tell me why it is easy as saying cheese doing the same in Ableton? Shouldn't it be easy implementing it?

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Audiocave » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:44 pm

I read the thread which took some odd turns having nothing to do with the OP but anyway, as was said or suggested earlier I think...

You can - much like using bus paths in the PT routing matrix - create dummy busses in VST Outputs to route audio this way from any audio output path to the input of any audio track. Just create some busses (outputs in VST Outputs) to use for this, don't assign them to any hardware, name them so you know what they are, and store them in your default I/O setup.

To send the output of a VI into a audio track point (send, assign directly, whatever) it to one of the dummy outs and assign the input of the audio track to that path. I've been doing this since mid v4 I think. Using groups for that just adds more clutter to arrange.

Additionally, I'm not sure what all the other stuff about ASIO and midi and capabilities has to do with any of this as relates to maybe doing it directly in the future. You can already send audio directly from one track to another via VST 3 side chaining so it seems like the internal paths may already exist in the protocols, to send audio to another track, or pull a signal in from another track.

If a VST3 plug they created can do it I think the people who developed the plug and the daw (and the protocols for both) can probably do it without the plug... create an audio path like that... with the current system. I also think if one could maybe insert a special plug just for that, to send audio directly to another track for whatever reason, it would probably suffice for those who need it and want to do a lot of that kinda thing I guess. I don't do it a lot though.
Last edited by Audiocave on Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:16 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by thinkingcap » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:50 pm

Audiocave wrote:...-Just create some busses (outputs in VST Outputs) to use for this, don't assign them to any hardware,..-
Just for the records: It even works with assigned busses (for the sake of streamlined and fast workflow)...
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Audiocave » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:55 pm

thinkingcap wrote:
Audiocave wrote:...-Just create some busses (outputs in VST Outputs) to use for this, don't assign them to any hardware,..-
Just for the records: It even works with assigned busses (for the sake of streamlined and fast workflow)...
Cheers. True.

Making them unassigned was (for me) a housekeeping thing, I didn't want those signals going anywhere else like actually traveling out of a hardware output by accident when I was only routing internally ... but yeah, it still works.

IIRC, mine were named D1 through D8 and/or DS1 - 8 (S for stereo) for "dummy" 1-8.

Thanks.

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Conman » Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:22 pm

Good to see at least two people read the manual. Others' tracks are, for the sake of streamlining, connected directly to the Cubase link to the forum complaints (aka WTF?!) department.

The THREE explanations are as loud and clear as anyone would need, but somehow it goes over the WTFheads. Thanks. Great stuff. :mrgreen:
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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by mustech » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:10 pm

Audiocave wrote: Just create some busses (outputs in VST Outputs) to use for this, don't assign them to any hardware, name them so you know what they are, and store them in your default I/O setup.
To send the output of a VI into a audio track point (send, assign directly, whatever) it to one of the dummy outs and assign the input of the audio track to that path.
Thanks, Audiocave!
That was very useful information. It works great! :-)

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Re: Routing from a VST instrument directly to a audio track?

Post by Guest » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:34 pm

dennisjr wrote:Ok I admit I know nothing about DAW's when it comes to programming, but please tell me why it is easy as saying cheese doing the same in Ableton? Shouldn't it be easy implementing it?
It is simply a case of how Steinberg DAW software has evolved.

Basically there would need to be a new routing system developed on top of the existing situation.

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