The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post general topics related to Cubase Pro 9, Cubase Artist 9 and Cubase Elements 9 here.
igbro
New Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:48 am
Contact:

The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by igbro » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:23 pm

Hi all, 9.0.3 upgrade was flawless on my Win7 setup.

New video engine seems to be integrated as there are no more child video processes running alongside Cubase. (Decode, etc...)

Good, but:

1) Cubase wasn't able to extract any audio from video importation (ticked in preferences)! Got only blank audio tracks.

Tried with dozens of files H.264 720p 25-30fps Mov or Mp4 container all with Mpeg AAC audio codec, witch seems to be the most common.
All those files where perfectly importing with audio into 8.5 and 9.0.2 thru the Quicktime engine.
Old projects, with already extracted audio, worked fine.

So at least, video (H.264) is playing but...

2) It's a CPU hog!

Simply toggling F8 (Any window size) while playing shows a huge 20-25% CPU overload or release in task manager on my I7 3770@3.4 (720p video!)
This is even more obvious when testing an empty project containing solely the video file.
Same videos playing within Cubase 8.5 (QuickTime) gives me 5% CPU usage on the same machine.

Reading the forum, I don't feel to be the only one. Please report your experience.

Is the new video engine really such less capable (and eating 4-5 times more CPU) than the old one?

Come on, what are you doing Steinberg?
Cubase 9.3 - Win7 x64 I7 3770@3.4 24Gb Ram + Slave Win7 x64 2x Xeon X5675@3.1 32Gb Ram - RME HDSP9652

Brian Roland
Member
Posts: 650
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:24 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Brian Roland » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:16 pm

I think it has to do with security issues on the Quicktime stuff...

Here's one statement from Steinberg on the matter:
https://www.steinberg.net/nc/en/support ... ndows.html

Many applications out there (not just Steinberg stuff) have been forced to put together some other option, or their users are at high security risk.

I'm not aware of the full story, but I gather Apple backed a lot of folks in the software business into a corner......they've decided to pull support for Quicktime on the Windows platform.

If waiting for the new engine to be optimized and features added isn't an option, one can run the video in a plugin like VidPlayVST until the new engine is up to the task.

Muxing and Demuxing [extracting/packing a/v streams into a video format container without transcoding] isn't a big deal these days with free utilities like ffmpeg. It's a command line utility, but there are numerous Graphical based shells out there for folks who hate the good ole command line. Xmedia Recode is one example of a free package that includes ffmpeg and a GUI for it.

Sorry, I do realize work-arounds are not a proper fix, but that's where we stand for now.

uarte
Member
Posts: 299
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:51 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by uarte » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:40 pm

@Brian, thanks for those links!

@igbro, I feel your pain. I'm not surprised that the video engine is half-baked though.

Larioso
Member
Posts: 466
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 9:18 am
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Larioso » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:47 pm

My guess is that it rather quickly be a fix for audio left out - or is the separate function to extract audio from video working?

Performance - it will probably take a while to fix. Since video engine was said to be ready already Q1 - and they waited for licensing stuff only until Nuendo 8 in june - one wonders how this was tested.

Last fall looking at video editors - Premiere Elements 15, Nero Video 2017 and PowerDirector 15 all removed quicktime requirement for most formats by then. And this VidPlayVst run fine without quicktime.

And both PowerDirector and Nero Video at least are very cpu efficient, as is the VidPlayVst plugin. Premiere a little more heavy.
So there seem not to be all due to there is no efficient player code out there.

Corel with VideoStudio and Pinnacle had not removed quicktime requirement then. Then they release v10 - don't know if they attended to that.

Magix Vegas - no idea if they bothered with this. Magix are not the fastest on maintenance overall - most stuff is at least 16-18 months lead time before fixed. Don't know if that time has passed since Magix bought all the Sony stuff.

Think it's time for vacations in germany now - so Steinberg might be gone for a month or so....they could have left everybody with a choice, a setting, to use quicktime still for those more dependent on it. It's not usable with this cpu consumption - at least the internal player.
Windows 7 Pro - Intel i7-860 2.8GHz 16 GB - Cubase Pro 9 latest - RME HDSP 9632 + AI4S - Nvidia GT730

Brian Roland
Member
Posts: 650
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:24 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Brian Roland » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:07 pm

Larioso wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:47 pm
....they could have left everybody with a choice, a setting, to use quicktime still for those more dependent on it. It's not usable with this cpu consumption - at least the internal player.
One would think so.....it probably was a difficult decision to make on how to handle the .30 release. Offering the option to keep the old engine and the the other updates...or...release something less than mature now and get feedback for the next release...or wait longer and face other sorts of problems...etc.

These days so much of those sorts of decisions are tied up with legal matters, while also being sorted with a lot of finite math (probabilities equations). I.E. The odds and percentages of CuBase pro users likely to actually use the Video engine. They have data on DAW sales...various sorts of consumer patterns and tolerance levels, etc. Pro studios typically test releases in an isolated bed somehow before implementing them in mission critical settings, etc...so I guess they do alot of risk assessment math and roll some dice.

I feel the pain, but over my lifetime there's never been a technical utopia....especially for the home user who always runs a risk of losing productivity during and after an update/grade. To those ends, I learned some time ago to keep different clones of the whole system drive on a swappable caddy, or in a multi-boot scenario....that way I can try stuff out, and rolling back is as simple as changing a hard drive or booting form a different partition.

Romantique Tp
Senior Member
Posts: 1626
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 3:25 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Romantique Tp » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:20 pm

Steinberg has been releasing updates earlier than usual. I think it's likely that they're planning to release a .40 update or maybe even a .50 with some additional video engine improvements.
;)

Cubase Pro and Wavelab Pro (latest), Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit, MSI Z87-G45 GAMING, i5 4690k, GeForce GTX 760, almost every Steinberg plugin and expansion, Trilian, Komplete 10, etc etc etc etc

Rob Elliott
Junior Member
Posts: 118
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:05 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Rob Elliott » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:30 pm

igbro wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:23 pm
Hi all, 9.0.3 upgrade was flawless on my Win7 setup.

New video engine seems to be integrated as there are no more child video processes running alongside Cubase. (Decode, etc...)

Good, but:

1) Cubase wasn't able to extract any audio from video importation (ticked in preferences)! Got only blank audio tracks.

Tried with dozens of files H.264 720p 25-30fps Mov or Mp4 container all with Mpeg AAC audio codec, witch seems to be the most common.
All those files where perfectly importing with audio into 8.5 and 9.0.2 thru the Quicktime engine.
Old projects, with already extracted audio, worked fine.

So at least, video (H.264) is playing but...

2) It's a CPU hog!

Simply toggling F8 (Any window size) while playing shows a huge 20-25% CPU overload or release in task manager on my I7 3770@3.4 (720p video!)
This is even more obvious when testing an empty project containing solely the video file.
Same videos playing within Cubase 8.5 (QuickTime) gives me 5% CPU usage on the same machine.

Reading the forum, I don't feel to be the only one. Please report your experience.

Is the new video engine really such less capable (and eating 4-5 times more CPU) than the old one?

Come on, what are you doing Steinberg?
I am having the VERY same issues as #1 above. extracting audio from video gives me 'empty' wave file as well. :( Other suggestions to even use this new vid engine - otherwise it's back to 8.5 (bummer - I actually liked C9.0.2 - now this 'step back'.)
"What would you attempt to do if you knew you could not fail?"


W7 - 64 bits - 24 gb ram / i7

igbro
New Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:48 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by igbro » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:47 pm

Thanks guys.

I don't think I'll pay extra money to compensate their lack with an external player.

Used to use this free player long time ago: http://forums.jeskola.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7
Will give it another try...

Maybe they'll quickly fix this beta thing but the problem is the meaning of "quickly" at Steinberg's house witch is not reactive anymore.
I doubt they'll fix it before 9.5 which we'll have to pay for.

I'm a early Cubase lover and pro user on daily basis since the Atari times (so that's V1.0 on 2 floppy disks) that's why I'm upset with the actual direction this company, which has been the leader in creativity and innovation in this market, is pointing to.
Cubase 9.3 - Win7 x64 I7 3770@3.4 24Gb Ram + Slave Win7 x64 2x Xeon X5675@3.1 32Gb Ram - RME HDSP9652

beanstalk40
Junior Member
Posts: 132
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:43 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by beanstalk40 » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:10 pm

Im deeply saddened.

I havent yet paid attention to the cpu consumption... because i'm still stuck at the extract audio functionnot working.

I use Cubase everyday for 8 hours a day... and scoring to video is my main profession... if this ultra basic feature is non existent, its a sad day for guys like me.

Working around it right now by using cubase 8.5 to extract audio and then importing track from project into cubase 9. What an unneccesary addition to workflow complexity.

I refuse to pay extra bucks to get vidplay vst.

Really pray that Steinberg fixes this fast.

:-(
Machine 1 - WIN 7 x64, Cubase 9 Pro, Intel Core i7 4790k, Gigabyte GA-Z97M-D3H, 16GB RAM, EMU 1820M

Machine 2 (laptop) - WIN 8.1 x64, Cubase 9 Pro, HP Envy J111TX, Core i7 4700MQ, 8GB RAM, Audient ID4

Rob Elliott
Junior Member
Posts: 118
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:05 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Rob Elliott » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:40 pm

Just thinking if this vid issue on importing audio is happening with our Nuendo/Cubendo brothers and sisters....they have to be close to torches and pitchforks by now. :(
"What would you attempt to do if you knew you could not fail?"


W7 - 64 bits - 24 gb ram / i7

zvenx
Member
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:59 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by zvenx » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:49 pm

Hi out of curiosity, is there anyone having this issue who is not on Windows 7?
rsp
richard sven patterson
sound sculptist
--------------------------
Nuendo 8| Gigabyte GAX79UP4 : Intel Hex Core Ivy Bridge Extreme 4930K : 32GB RAM | Windows 10 64bit| Lynx Two C | Midisport 2x2 | UAD-2 Quad |

Cubase 9 | MacBookPro Retina 2.8Ghz Quad Core I7 | 10.12.1 | 16GB | NI Komplete Audio 6 | UAD-2 Satellite Thunderbolt Quad |

Rob Elliott
Junior Member
Posts: 118
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:05 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Rob Elliott » Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:00 pm

zvenx wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:49 pm
Hi out of curiosity, is there anyone having this issue who is not on Windows 7?
rsp
Great question Richard.
"What would you attempt to do if you knew you could not fail?"


W7 - 64 bits - 24 gb ram / i7

zvenx
Member
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:59 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by zvenx » Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:30 pm

I see one user has 7 and 8.
@beanstalk40 does it happen on both of your machines?
rsp
richard sven patterson
sound sculptist
--------------------------
Nuendo 8| Gigabyte GAX79UP4 : Intel Hex Core Ivy Bridge Extreme 4930K : 32GB RAM | Windows 10 64bit| Lynx Two C | Midisport 2x2 | UAD-2 Quad |

Cubase 9 | MacBookPro Retina 2.8Ghz Quad Core I7 | 10.12.1 | 16GB | NI Komplete Audio 6 | UAD-2 Satellite Thunderbolt Quad |

beanstalk40
Junior Member
Posts: 132
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:43 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by beanstalk40 » Fri Aug 18, 2017 8:07 pm

zvenx wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:30 pm
I see one user has 7 and 8.
@beanstalk40 does it happen on both of your machines?
rsp
Dont know about WIN 8... havent used my laptop yet for this...
Machine 1 - WIN 7 x64, Cubase 9 Pro, Intel Core i7 4790k, Gigabyte GA-Z97M-D3H, 16GB RAM, EMU 1820M

Machine 2 (laptop) - WIN 8.1 x64, Cubase 9 Pro, HP Envy J111TX, Core i7 4700MQ, 8GB RAM, Audient ID4

zvenx
Member
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:59 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by zvenx » Fri Aug 18, 2017 8:49 pm

Ok if you get a chance, would appreciate it to see if it is just a WIN7 thing.
rsp
richard sven patterson
sound sculptist
--------------------------
Nuendo 8| Gigabyte GAX79UP4 : Intel Hex Core Ivy Bridge Extreme 4930K : 32GB RAM | Windows 10 64bit| Lynx Two C | Midisport 2x2 | UAD-2 Quad |

Cubase 9 | MacBookPro Retina 2.8Ghz Quad Core I7 | 10.12.1 | 16GB | NI Komplete Audio 6 | UAD-2 Satellite Thunderbolt Quad |

digitalson
Member
Posts: 299
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:34 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by digitalson » Fri Aug 18, 2017 8:56 pm

Same here win 7 ,even video files that played fine before are not responsive like it use to be.....I'm curious about decklink users,how video is handled by the card?
i7 ,64gb 1866 mem x79 chipset, ssd os,4 x ssd drives raid 0 motu pci 96 ins and outs @96k for external gear
tons of vintage outboard gear 3 monitors and 42" LCD for spotting to film
Windows 7 pro 64 sp1
Gtx 780 ,all liquid cooled CPU overclocked to 4 ghz

Romantique Tp
Senior Member
Posts: 1626
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2015 3:25 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Romantique Tp » Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:38 pm

Not being able to extract audio is a Windows 7-only issue at the moment. Steinberg says that they're working on a fix:

https://helpcenter.steinberg.de/hc/en-u ... d-Nuendo-8

For now you'll have to use free tools to extract audio from video files, but at least you don't have to worry about Quicktime leaving your computer unsafe anymore.
;)

Cubase Pro and Wavelab Pro (latest), Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit, MSI Z87-G45 GAMING, i5 4690k, GeForce GTX 760, almost every Steinberg plugin and expansion, Trilian, Komplete 10, etc etc etc etc

zvenx
Member
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:59 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by zvenx » Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:58 pm

Ahh indeed.... another work around is if you have 8.5 installed you can use that to import video. Save the project and then open that project in Cubase 9.
rsp
richard sven patterson
sound sculptist
--------------------------
Nuendo 8| Gigabyte GAX79UP4 : Intel Hex Core Ivy Bridge Extreme 4930K : 32GB RAM | Windows 10 64bit| Lynx Two C | Midisport 2x2 | UAD-2 Quad |

Cubase 9 | MacBookPro Retina 2.8Ghz Quad Core I7 | 10.12.1 | 16GB | NI Komplete Audio 6 | UAD-2 Satellite Thunderbolt Quad |

adunion
Junior Member
Posts: 88
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:12 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by adunion » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:36 am

I'm thinking... can't you just extract the audio from the video file using VLC? That should be the easiest workaround for now.

https://www.howtogeek.com/66165/from-th ... uring-boot./
PC: Cubase Pro 9.0.30, Cubase 6.5.5 - Intel Core i7 2600 3.4 Ghz (Sandy Bridge Intel DP67BG MoBo) - 24 GB RAM - All SSD's - ASUS NVIDIA GeForce GT730, 2 Gb Graphics - Windows 7 Pro SP1/64-bit - UAD-2 Solo - RME Fireface UFX - Blackmagic Intensity Pro PCIx - Dell U3011 monitor @ 2560x1600 + LG Monitor @ 1920x1080

Mac: Cubase Pro 9.0.20, Cubase 6.5.5 - Macbook Pro Retina i7 2.5 Ghz - 16 GB RAM - Mac OSX 10.9.5 - UA Apollo Twin Solo

User avatar
djw
Senior Member
Posts: 1591
Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2015 2:49 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by djw » Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:11 pm

60 fps content doesn't play at 60 fps and drops frames on my system, especially when in full screen.
🥕
Specs: Latest versions of Cubase Pro, Dorico, WaveLab Pro, Windows 10, AMD Phenom II 1100T, 8GB RAM, AMD R9 390, YS CI1

Maincat
Member
Posts: 270
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2010 6:34 pm
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by Maincat » Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:04 pm

I'm having no problem importing video. The video plays, the audio is extracted. Used MP4 as the test.
Steve
Cubase Pro 9.5, Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit, 8 Gig RAM, AMD Phenom II 955 BE X4, 27" Acer LCD, GX460, Steinberg UR242, Yamaha KX8, Nektar LX88, Shure SM58, Yamaha HS50Ms with Yamaha HS8M Sub., The Grand 3.1, Neo Soul Keys, Groove Agent 4, ASUS Nexus 7 2013, Android 6.0, Cubase IC PRO and lots of other stuff.

User avatar
groovelandrecords
New Member
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:54 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by groovelandrecords » Sun Sep 03, 2017 6:58 pm

Likewise here, unable to extract audio from a video file on Windows 7. Reverted back to 9.0.20 for now. Hopefully a new fix will come soon

User avatar
gamelany
Junior Member
Posts: 107
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 6:34 pm
Location: Vienna
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by gamelany » Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:18 pm

dragged a mp4-video and everything works perfektly - very komfortable !
SW: Win10(64) , Cubase Pro latest, GA4
HW: i5/16GB/Asus/SSD, Delta2496

User avatar
peakae
Senior Member
Posts: 2136
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 8:15 pm
Location: Bedroom
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by peakae » Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:29 pm

What is not clear in the following ?
Future developments planned for future updates

AAC Audio Extract on Win 7 is in development.
AJA video device support is also in development.
Replace Audio in Video is no longer possible. As an alternative, video render export functionality (including audio) is planned.
MXF container support is also planned.
Cubase Pro 9.5, Wavelab Elements 9, I7 3770K , win10x64, 16Gb Ram, RME Raydat, Steinberg MR816x, Motu 828mkII, Behringer ADA8200, Yamaha moXF6, Steinberg UR242, Yamaha THR 10, Cambridge Audio DacMagic Plus, CMC TP, CMC CH.

User avatar
djw
Senior Member
Posts: 1591
Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2015 2:49 am
Contact:

Re: The 9.0.3 new video engine seems a serious downgrade.

Post by djw » Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:47 pm

Optimization should be part of it too, it's a shame that it drops frames for me and uses a lot of cpu for everyone.
🥕
Specs: Latest versions of Cubase Pro, Dorico, WaveLab Pro, Windows 10, AMD Phenom II 1100T, 8GB RAM, AMD R9 390, YS CI1

Post Reply

Return to “General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: DrFuture, fendare and 12 guests