Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by MattiasNYC » Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:55 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:Nuendo as a nieche market product is very reasonably priced.

I'm happy to throw money at Steinberg for their outstanding work for every .5 update as long as the features keep coming and the platform is actively being developed. 7 is the best Nuendo ever.
And that's exactly the reason why we get stuff like broken VCAs capable of boosting levels +12dB without the user asking for it.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by psvennevig » Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:04 pm

I agree that updates/fixes comes to seldom.

That said I think we'll get an update to Nuendo quite soon.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by fenderchris » Wed Apr 20, 2016 1:18 am

I actually believe that fixing bugs will bring in the money. It will create many happy users which will result in many more posts on this forum from satisfied customers. This in turn will help convince anyone thinking of getting into Nuendo to take the leap. That's got to be better than a bunch of posts complaining about things not working as advertised.

I agree with the comments about the GUI. PG has listened to the users comments about Wavélab 7 and 8 and completely scrapped the design for a new one in WL 9 - Very popular it is too. The Nuendo designers should think about doing the same.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by lukasbrooklyn » Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:19 am

fenderchris wrote:I actually believe that fixing bugs will bring in the money. It will create many happy users which will result in many more posts on this forum from satisfied customers. This in turn will help convince anyone thinking of getting into Nuendo to take the leap. That's got to be better than a bunch of posts complaining about things not working as advertised.

I agree with the comments about the GUI. PG has listened to the users comments about Wavélab 7 and 8 and completely scrapped the design for a new one in WL 9 - Very popular it is too. The Nuendo designers should think about doing the same.
i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well. if that is the case, it may be as easy as letting that person go or providing them a helping hand from someone in the know.
system// i7 4930k, w7 x64, c7.5.4, (c8)
audio// RME HDSP, SSL duende, audeze lcd-2, klein&hummel o300, adam s2x, lavry DA, avantone mixcubes, EL Fatso ...

http://www.lukasturza.com // http://www.snapmastering.com // music production / mixing / mastering [hybris, upbeats, noisia, rem koolhaas, czech television, havas, ogilvy, ...]

cubendo supercharged workflow ideas/threads of possible interest:
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=63450
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=38182
my supercharged workflow videos:
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by ChrisPolus » Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:37 am

fenderchris wrote:I agree with the comments about the GUI. PG has listened to the users comments about Wavélab 7 and 8 and completely scrapped the design for a new one in WL 9 - Very popular it is too. The Nuendo designers should think about doing the same.
I just looked at some Wavelab 9 windows including the video about Friedemann Tischmeyer. He wasn't happy with Wavelab 7 and 8 either ;) And I have to say, judging from the video, they really did a complete overhaul and it looks soooo much better! This is really an intelligent GUI. It looks easy on the eyes, it has color coded sections so the eye can quickly find what you're looking for in a longer list, the GUI takes away options that don't apply for the window you're in, the tab concept looks like it would work well. I've played with Wavelab 8 two years ago and it was horrible. This looks like a great way forward.

It would be great if Steinberg took the time to really re-think Nuendo's interface. It feels so crammed together and function after function added to create a mess of UI paradigms. Well, only time will tell. But if this thread is any indication, people are ready for a change.
lukasbrooklyn wrote:
fenderchris wrote:i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well. if that is the case, it may be as easy as letting that person go or providing them a helping hand from someone in the know.
Unbelievable. For that, it's astounding what this one person has to juggle. But it's very sad that not more weight is given to this CRITICAL area. What good are the best plugins and functions if nobody can find them, use them, if they create constant frustration. Just watch the video of Friedemann Tischmeyer on the Wavelab 9 product page (http://www.steinberg.net/en/products/wavelab/start.html). He clearly says: there were too many icons, everything was a mess. And then he says when you do a task hundred times a day, an improvement in the workflow goes a long way. He's so right. Currently I feel like Nuendo has great functionality but it's obstructed by roadblocks at every corner. Making it difficult to use those functions fluently.

I'm sure one could save at least one to two clicks for many processing steps. Saving two clicks is a big deal if you do this hundred times a day.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by lukasbrooklyn » Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:48 am

ChrisPolus wrote:
fenderchris wrote:I agree with the comments about the GUI. PG has listened to the users comments about Wavélab 7 and 8 and completely scrapped the design for a new one in WL 9 - Very popular it is too. The Nuendo designers should think about doing the same.
I just looked at some Wavelab 9 windows including the video about Friedemann Tischmeyer. He wasn't happy with Wavelab 7 and 8 either ;) And I have to say, judging from the video, they really did a complete overhaul and it looks soooo much better! This is really an intelligent GUI. It looks easy on the eyes, it has color coded sections so the eye can quickly find what you're looking for in a longer list, the GUI takes away options that don't apply for the window you're in, the tab concept looks like it would work well. I've played with Wavelab 8 two years ago and it was horrible. This looks like a great way forward.

It would be great if Steinberg took the time to really re-think Nuendo's interface. It feels so crammed together and function after function added to create a mess of UI paradigms. Well, only time will tell. But if this thread is any indication, people are ready for a change.
lukasbrooklyn wrote:
fenderchris wrote:i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well. if that is the case, it may be as easy as letting that person go or providing them a helping hand from someone in the know.
Unbelievable. For that, it's astounding what this one person has to juggle. But it's very sad that not more weight is given to this CRITICAL area. What good are the best plugins and functions if nobody can find them, use them, if they create constant frustration. Just watch video of Friedemann Tischmeyer on the Wavelab 9 product page. He clearly says: there were too many icons, everything was a mess. And then he says when you do a task hundred times a day, an improvement in the workflow goes a long way. He's so right. Currently I feel like Nuendo has great functionality but it's obstructed by roadblocks at every corner. Making it difficult to use those functions fluently.

I'm sure one could save at least one to two clicks for many processing steps. Saving two clicks is a big deal if you do this hundred times a day.
you've pretty much nailed it-- the added functionalities are implemented in a completely non-systemic way, and with their introduction often comes an introduction of a completely new GUI element, unrelated to the existing GUI, and incongruent in its functionality to the rest of the program -- a prime example is the new pop up menu in C8.5 that appears automatically as the mouse cursor hovers over the edge of the screen. or little details, like the 'e' icon for 'channel settings' being completely different in the project window, and in the mixconsole.

especially to new users this is very confusing and unprofessional looking. it's these things that had become second nature to you, that start becoming evident as you try to explain the software to a newcomer.

it's kind of like teaching your language to someone and realizing how full of exceptions and illogical rules it is, because of the nature of languages being living organisms developing haphazardly throughout history.

/

except this is software, which can and should be made logical.
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http://www.lukasturza.com // http://www.snapmastering.com // music production / mixing / mastering [hybris, upbeats, noisia, rem koolhaas, czech television, havas, ogilvy, ...]

cubendo supercharged workflow ideas/threads of possible interest:
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=63450
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=38182
my supercharged workflow videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ellGhSdmXfk

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Fredo » Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:57 am

lukasbrooklyn wrote: i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well.
Nonsense.

This goes back to the very early versions of which Dave was for the most part responsable for the GUI.
And back then, he was nothing short of a hero.
Actually, to me he still is.

Fredo

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by lukasbrooklyn » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:14 am

Fredo wrote:
lukasbrooklyn wrote: i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well.
Nonsense.

This goes back to the very early versions of which Dave was for the most part responsable for the GUI.
And back then, he was nothing short of a hero.
Actually, to me he still is.

Fredo
then i shall plus-one. the older nuendo gui's are still elegant to this day, for this reason i sometimes work with N4 as it's easier on the eyes, when i don't require any new functionalities. (the fact events' edges change colour in realtime as you hover over them alone -- which had not been the case in older versions -- is a major visual distraction that i've wished could be turned off since its introduction.)
Last edited by lukasbrooklyn on Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:17 am, edited 3 times in total.
system// i7 4930k, w7 x64, c7.5.4, (c8)
audio// RME HDSP, SSL duende, audeze lcd-2, klein&hummel o300, adam s2x, lavry DA, avantone mixcubes, EL Fatso ...

http://www.lukasturza.com // http://www.snapmastering.com // music production / mixing / mastering [hybris, upbeats, noisia, rem koolhaas, czech television, havas, ogilvy, ...]

cubendo supercharged workflow ideas/threads of possible interest:
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=63450
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=38182
my supercharged workflow videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ellGhSdmXfk

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by ChrisPolus » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:16 am

lukasbrooklyn wrote:prime example is the new pop up menu in C8.5 that appears automatically as the mouse cursor hovers over the edge of the screen. or little details, like the 'e' icon for 'channel settings' being completely different in the project window, and in the mixconsole.

it's kind of like teaching your language to someone
GUI IS a language. It communicates with the user and shows where he can find the functionality. And yes, I've seen the "new cool feature" they show in the "Accessibility and workflow 1" video (https://youtu.be/D2pE5-zM52c?t=21). This is HORRIBLE! I cannot understand how anybody thought this was a good idea: There's no button that communicates you can click something to change windows layout. You have to _know_ where it is. Very bad for discoverability. The area where you can click seems super small, only a few pixels so you have to precisely position your mouse there. How can this be "accessible"? Did anybody complain about the window layout button? Is this what they call "improving accessibility and workflow"? I doubt this particular feature helps any workflow at all.

Here you have to click, there you have to hover your mouse over a 2 pixel small area, in some other instance you have to know where to move your mouse to and then click. This sounds like: We have no idea where to put this new feature, let's make the user hover somewhere and then yet another menu pops up where we can cram 5 new things into. This feature alone screams UI redesign to me.

Also think about the people with a multi-monitor setup that have screens on the left, the right, and maybe above as well. You cannot just throw your mouse to the edge of the monitor. If you do that, you land on the adjecent monitor. You really have to carefully position your mouse on the edge so you don't slip to the next monitor. This takes a lot more time than just going up to the button and enable the panes with a click on the checkbox.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by lukasbrooklyn » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:20 am

ChrisPolus wrote:: There's no button that communicates you can click something to change windows layout. You have to _know_ where it is. Very bad for discoverability. The area where you can click seems super small, only a few pixels so you have to precisely position your mouse there.
in practical use, this is actually worse, and the opposite case: the menu gets triggered randomly when performing other tasks, whilst obstructing the user's view and workflow.
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http://www.lukasturza.com // http://www.snapmastering.com // music production / mixing / mastering [hybris, upbeats, noisia, rem koolhaas, czech television, havas, ogilvy, ...]

cubendo supercharged workflow ideas/threads of possible interest:
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=63450
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtop ... 81&t=38182
my supercharged workflow videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ellGhSdmXfk

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:42 am

Fredo wrote:
lukasbrooklyn wrote: i heard the gui aspect of cubendo is a one-man show as well.
Nonsense.

This goes back to the very early versions of which Dave was for the most part responsable for the GUI.
And back then, he was nothing short of a hero.
Actually, to me he still is.

Fredo
Actually, the entire Nuendo team are superheroes if you ask me.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Big K » Wed Apr 20, 2016 3:24 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:Actually, the entire Nuendo team are superheroes if you ask me.
Is that to be taken with a grain of salt?
Heroes,...maybe, .. if you like.
As long as I have to hurt my eyes with this GUI, getting nuts over aiming my cursor onto those tiny clickboxes and being distracted from my creative audio work by trying to remember what hidden function can be called up where ...
Calling them Heroes is the utmost you get out of me... No super there ...
;-)

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Wed Apr 20, 2016 5:36 pm

Superheroes, nothing short of superheroes if you ask me.
I spend a lot of my time with this tool and I really and very honestly love what we can do with it. No irony at all!
For me it's by far the best DAW GUI/workflow I have ever worked on. Of course there is room for improvement, but still it's the one I like best.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by MattiasNYC » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:12 pm

Oliver.Lucas wrote:Actually, the entire Nuendo team are superheroes if you ask me.
We must not be thinking of the same product called "Nuendo" then. Unless messing up VCAs on release, as well as two subsequent updates "fixing it", while claiming in release notes it was fixed, while the marketing guy makes bold statements about it in press, is superhero-status-inducing.....

And then there's the fiddly GUI with the hover-buttons that work really well for everyone under the age of 40 and with great vision.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Thu Apr 21, 2016 8:42 am

Lydiot wrote:
Oliver.Lucas wrote:Actually, the entire Nuendo team are superheroes if you ask me.
We must not be thinking of the same product called "Nuendo" then. Unless messing up VCAs on release, as well as two subsequent updates "fixing it", while claiming in release notes it was fixed, while the marketing guy makes bold statements about it in press, is superhero-status-inducing.....

And then there's the fiddly GUI with the hover-buttons that work really well for everyone under the age of 40 and with great vision.
Oh, I got myself some glasses when I turned 40.... 8-)
The VCA thing needs to be fixed, you are of course right. I don't need them for my workflow. There are so many opportunities to do what I want to do in Nuendo, so it does not really stop me.

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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by ChrisPolus » Thu Apr 21, 2016 9:32 am

For anybody who hasn't seen this:
viewtopic.php?f=240&t=96222&p=533378#p533371

In short: Video engine is prioritized and broken out from update 7.5. Update with video engine will come this year. Update 7.5 with other improvements and features will NOT come this year.
Last edited by ChrisPolus on Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:15 pm

ChrisPolus wrote:For anybody who hasn't seen this:
viewtopic.php?f=240&t=96222&p=533378#p533371

In short: Video engine is prioritized, will come his year because it's no longer part of 7.5. Update 7.5 will NOT come this year.
Okay, so the Nuendo development time is spent on a new video engine and then they spend some time for new Cubase features for christmas.
Thanks go out to Apple for raining on our parade!
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by lemix » Thu Apr 21, 2016 3:07 pm

Gentlemen,

If we could put our specific area of audio related tasks aside for a moment...
We are all ( at least to some degree) somewhat computer and applications configurations savvy.
We all have been doing paying gigs for a while and have our own established workflows for each specific scenario.
So...why constantly bombarding developers of their product's ( goes for all DAWs ) shortcomings ?

DAW X does things more fluently than DAW Y. It always will be the case.
Just as my personal example...at the end of last year after 6 full years of abandonment from PT, I have now both Nuendo and PT installed on my PC.
They share all third party plugins and fluently exchange media via AAF.
I am not sure if this solution would work for everyone, but IMHO in this current day and age the logical solution for me.
Yes, takes longer to finish a project..luckily I can bill that extra time. So should you.

Just my opinion of course..
cheers,
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by ChrisPolus » Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:05 am

Good news at least for people waiting for a VCA fix. Timo just answered a question in another thread, saying that 7.0.40 is on the way to us, scheduled for early May, where "a lot of" VCA problems should be fixed. I'm just curious what "a lot" means ;)

viewtopic.php?f=240&t=96222#p533482
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Bassman » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:09 pm

I'm waiting for independent Punch In and Outpoint for so long time and now, waiting until 2017? ... not good news.
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by MattiasNYC » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:46 pm

ChrisPolus wrote:saying that 7.0.40 is on the way to us, scheduled for early May, where "a lot of" VCA problems should be fixed. I'm just curious what "a lot" means ;)
I'll believe it when I see it...
Bassman wrote:I'm waiting for independent Punch In and Outpoint for so long time and now, waiting until 2017? ... not good news.
What is this you're referring to?
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:04 pm

ChrisPolus wrote:...
I'm just curious what "a lot" means ;)
...
I guess "a lot" means probably all, but he does not want to get burned. ;)
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by ChrisPolus » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:07 pm

Lydiot wrote:
Bassman wrote:I'm waiting for independent Punch In and Outpoint for so long time and now, waiting until 2017? ... not good news.
What is this you're referring to?
I guess the feature that's new in Cubase 8.5. Where you have the locators on the timeline that define a range, in 8.5 you can set special punch-in and -out locators independently. Just take a look at the Cubase 8.5 what's new videos on the product page. This is new in Cubase, so it'll take a while to show up in Nuendo anyway I guess.
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Bassman
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Bassman » Fri Apr 22, 2016 5:55 pm

ChrisPolus wrote:
Lydiot wrote:
Bassman wrote:I'm waiting for independent Punch In and Outpoint for so long time and now, waiting until 2017? ... not good news.
What is this you're referring to?
I guess the feature that's new in Cubase 8.5. Where you have the locators on the timeline that define a range, in 8.5 you can set special punch-in and -out locators independently. Just take a look at the Cubase 8.5 what's new videos on the product page. This is new in Cubase, so it'll take a while to show up in Nuendo anyway I guess.
Exactly ... perfect function for Songwriters like me, who play and record all instruments by my self.
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Oliver.Lucas
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Re: Nuendo 7.5 - Any known info?

Post by Oliver.Lucas » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:08 pm

Bassman wrote: Exactly ... perfect function for Songwriters like me, who play and record all instruments by my self.
Perfect for ADR as well.
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